Spanish election results

03.15.04

Michele on the Spanish election results:

The terrorists got what they wanted. They won.

And now the U.S. will have one less ally. One less country to count on the war against terrorism. They’ll pull out of Iraq and it won’t be long before they pull out of fighting the terrorists all together. Appeasement is the new black.

Welcome to the new age of al-Qaid and radical Islam on the whole, built on the deaths of 200 people. They’ve been emboldened by the Spanish left. They’ve been told that terrorism works, terrorism gets results.

{ 10 comments… read them below or add one }

1 Joshua 03.16.04 at 9:00 PM

This has to be one of the dumbest things I have ever heard. They want to kill us for who we are! They don’t need encouragement! If they were encouraged by the results, or learned that terrorism works, that would assumed they had goals they were trying to achieve and terrorism was the means to that end. They want to kill us for being who we are! THAT IS THEIR GOAL! It doesnt matter what we do.

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2 Joshua 03.16.04 at 9:03 PM

The left may be nuts, but stop trying to blame them for the acts of terrorists. If we blame them for encouraging terrorists, then we can blame the US for their invasion of Iraq. People act because they believe they are doing the right thing. If terrorists get encouraged by something, we cannot blame each other. Its the terrorists who are to blame.

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3 segacs 03.16.04 at 9:51 PM

Joshua, consider the following two statements:

1) Hitler was wrong to murder 6 million Jews.

2) Chamberlain was wrong to appease Hitler.

Statements 1 and 2 are obviously different in terms of degree; the Nazis bear the guilt for the Holocaust, of that there is no question. But that doesn’t make the guilt that Chamberlain bore for appeasing Hitler any less.

Two wrongs don’t make a right.

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4 Joshua 03.16.04 at 11:09 PM

Hitler had his expansionist plans already, the only thing Chamberlain did was postpone a war Britain was not ready for. Hitler was always very nervous about Britain joining the conflict over Poland. The “appeasement” did not affect Hitler’s intentions, he was still scared of Britain. It did not ‘encourage’ him in any way. Chamberlain also followed British ‘appeasement’ policy which was the main theme of British diplomatic history since their emergence from ‘splendid isolation’ (eg. Entente Cordiale, Afgahnistan Agreement). The only difference is that Chamberlain knew Hitler would not keep the peace. Chamberlain bears little guilt for Munich, as they could not go to war at the time.

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5 Joshua 03.16.04 at 11:10 PM

That aside, accusing the Spanish left of encouraging al-qaeda is illgical, because the US has done much to fuel the fire and encourage support for al-qaeda as well. Those reckless acts committed by the US have NOT demonstrably struck a blow against terrorism (as they were ‘supposed’ to do), but certainly encouraged it. If the US does something to ’embolden’ the terrorists, then you ought to hold them just as responsible as the Spanish left. The point is, whatever the Spanish left does or the US does, does not justify terrorism and it is unfair to blame other people for ‘encouraging’ terrorism, unless they deliberately support it. The most they can be accused of is naivety, and even that is debatable.

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6 Knave 03.17.04 at 8:35 AM

because the US has done much to fuel the fire and encourage support for al-qaeda as well.

Whenever I hear someone say that, I get a little quesy. Its kinda like blaming the rape victim for wearing sexy clothes.

“You provoked the terrorists, so now you are getting what you deserve”. A lesson to learn and live by.

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7 Joshua 03.18.04 at 1:55 AM

Knave, exactly. Then how can you blame the ‘Spanish left’ for inciting terrorism?

Plus the fact, one cannot use the means to discredit the goals, unless their main goal is just to pointlessly kill people. One can do something to provoke an attack. That doesn’t mean we should let terrorists roam free. We should indeed stop them. But it is downright stupid to completely the possibility that one may do things which lend support to extremists.

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8 Joshua 03.18.04 at 1:56 AM

Granted if you walk around a bar naked and tease men, it is not your fault if you get raped, because no one has the right, no matter what, to rape you. However, doing something like that is still a stupid thing to do. When you flaunt your money in the wrong area at 3am, one must still look at one’s actions in light of the reality that one might get mugged. It doesn’t mean mugging is right, but the ‘victim’ can do stupid things which they ought to avoid if they are truly interested in avoiding getting hurt. And the US is not exactly a ‘victim’ in the world. Yes terrorism is wrong, but that does not make the US right.

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9 Knave 03.18.04 at 7:34 AM

Knave, exactly. Then how can you blame the ‘Spanish left’ for inciting terrorism?

I never said that.

I said that the “Spanish Left” (another term I’m fairly sure I have never used) acted irresponsibly. I refuse to accept the notion that terrorism can ever be incited.

As an analogy, in the phillipines, there used to be a major problem with kidnappings. The victims were never to blame for these crimes. However, the families had 2 choices:

1) Pay up
2) Don’t pay

If enough people pay up, then it becomes cost-effective to engage in kidnapping, and it continues. However, if people stop paying, then the kidnapping eventually ends since its easier to rob a gas station.

Note, of course, that the kidnappers are always wrong. Paying up perpetuates this wrong, but the kidnappers are still to blame.

Is it necessary for me to make the comparison explicit?

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10 Joshua 03.18.04 at 9:09 PM

I didn’t say you blamed the spanish left, but some people do. My point was that if you cannot blame the US for encouraging support for terrorism, then you can’t blame the spanish left for the same thing, ultimately because it’s the terrorists who are in the wrong.

If suggesting that paying up perpetuates this wrong, then in a sense you are blaming the victim. Although I agree that it does encourage it. But naturally, one has to be prepared not to pay and to accept the consequences of dead victims. And the US, like the spanish left, have done things that encourage support for terrorism.

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